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Re: Insomniac's question

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avatar Insomniac's question
March 11, 2009 11:15PM
O.K., it's 2:00 AM and sleep appears to be an alien concept again so I''ll just bug you folks.

It is understood that one absolutely must enter the wilderness area via the trailhead on one's permit. But what about exiting? How stringent are the rangers about you leaving via the exit trailhead on your permit?

I ask this because I'm admitting to myself that the hiking schedule planned and already permitted for July may be more aggressive than the old body may be up to. The only altitude acclimation I'm going to get is a single day hike before doing overnighters. If I get a day or so into the overnight schedules and realize I've bitten off more than I can chew, how flexible can I be about shortening my miles and exiting via a different trailhead than what's on the permit?

Not sure if it was this website but somebody wrote that once you're in the wilderness you are actually free to go wherever you want to for as long as you want to on that permit as long as you don't come out to a road. Is that really true?

avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 11, 2009 11:21PM
tomdisco wrote:

> O.K., it's 2:00 AM and sleep appears to be an alien concept
> again so I''ll just bug you folks.

Only 2 AM? That's kid stuff.

> It is understood that one absolutely must enter the wilderness
> area via the trailhead on one's permit. But what about
> exiting? How stringent are the rangers about you leaving via
> the exit trailhead on your permit?

I've never heard of any problem with exit points and quatas only apply to trailheads.

avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 11, 2009 11:26PM
From one Insomniac to another: I took this quote out of the NPS site and it seems to infer that it is only the ENTRY POINT that is limited by the permit, but this is my interpretation....


"After the first night, you may hike to another section of the Wilderness without restriction. For this reason, even if you have a permit lasting for several days, you may not begin your trip on any day except the first day your permit is valid."

http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/wildpermits.htm

B
avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 11, 2009 11:57PM
That's OK, I'm in Phoenix and am getting ready to drive back to L.A. in an hour or so.

Confirming Rick's reply, the quota system only limits the number of people entering from a given trailhead on a given day - they really don't care what you do after that as far as modifying your itinerary. (The schedule that you give them is basically so that they know generally where to look for you if a SAR is needed.)
avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 12, 2009 08:52AM
szalkowski wrote:

> That's OK, I'm in Phoenix and am getting ready to drive back to
> L.A. in an hour or so.
>
> Confirming Rick's reply, the quota system only limits the
> number of people entering from a given trailhead on a given day
> - they really don't care what you do after that as far as
> modifying your itinerary. (The schedule that you give them is
> basically so that they know generally where to look for you if
> a SAR is needed.)

The only thing I've saw on my Yosemite wilderness permit was the entry and exit trailheads. I think I mentioned planned stops in the permit reservation call, but I don't know if it was even noted. In any case, I've been told that the most important thing is the entry trailhead since that's where the quota is enforced. I was also told that a modification of plans shouldn't be a problem.

As far as a real itinerary, I do remember filling out planned waypoints right on a day use permit at Desolation Wilderness near Lake Tahoe. I guess that's for a possibility that SAR is needed. The Forest Service seems to be more paranoid about people entering the wilderness even for day use. Their overnight quota system is for a zone for the first night's stay, and they do charge by the night with a fee cap. Did I ever mention that I found a kid separated from his group there a couple of years ago? He was fairly calm and glad to get back to a road and where his cell phone worked so he could call up his group leader.

Isn't there matter of the maximum number of days you can spend on a trip? Also it might be easier if there's a permit check at the backpackers campground if the dates match up. I haven't experienced that, but isn't it a possibility?



Post Edited (03-12-09 09:05)
avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 12, 2009 11:38AM
y_p_w wrote:


> The only thing I've saw on my Yosemite wilderness permit was
> the entry and exit trailheads.

You're right, I forgot that Yosemite had stopped asking for projected overnight camping locations. (Was it last year that they quit, or 2007?) Sequoia/Kings and Lassen still want them.
avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 12, 2009 11:50AM
szalkowski wrote:

> You're right, I forgot that Yosemite had stopped asking for
> projected overnight camping locations. (Was it last year that
> they quit, or 2007?) Sequoia/Kings and Lassen still want them.

Nothing more than entry/exit trailheads and intended first night camping location on the reservation form.

http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/upload/wildpermitform.pdf

And they're now charging both the $5 for the reservation and $5 per person if reserved? It was only $5 for the reservation when I did it.

avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 12, 2009 02:02PM
I guess the answer to my question is that there is flexibility once you are in the wilderness area. I presumed the exit trailheads and exit dates were for SAR purposes but didn't know for sure. They seemed to want me to be pretty specific about exit points and dates of exit when I made the permit requests.

Anyway, it will be a great relief to know that I can change my plans once I'm on the trails to occomodate unexpected fatigue factors. At my age backpacking up to 10 miles with lots of altitude gain on any given day is not a problem. I just don't how it's going to feel trying to do it several days in a row. My wife thinks my hiking schedule is overly ambitious but that's one of the reasons she's not going.

Many years ago a friend and I did 3 days worth of the Appalachian Trail in some of the steepest portions in Maine. We embarked on that trip with absolutely no prior conditioning, had a terrific first day, and ran out of gas half way thru the second day! We simply hit a wall and literally could not put one foot in front of the other for more than 100' before stopping for long breaks. I learned my lesson from that and have been conditioning myself since October for the July trip.
avatar Re: Insomniac's question
March 12, 2009 05:30PM
Tomdisco: We simply hit a wall


I tried to do a 50 mile bike ride this last Sunday (thinking that the running would have conditioned me) not only did I run out of oomph, but I ran out of daylight two hours too soon. It seems that I need to be reminded of this fitness lesson at least once a season per sport!

B
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