Re: Deadly Domestic Sheep Disease Threatens Endangered Sierra Nevada Bighorn

What a strange article. Did miss something? What is the "Deadly Domestic Sheep Disease" ? They should have at least listed the disease or diseases of concern.

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The cure for a fallacious argument is a better argument, not the suppression of ideas.
-- Carl Sagan

The sheep disease has been, supposedly, a problem for DECADES.

Please, stop the scare tactics. People pay way more attention nowadays.

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Vince
Please, stop the scare tactics.

?scare tactics? I was more baffled than scared by the article. What exactly is the "deadly sheep disease"?
The primary threat to sheep in the Rockies is predation (mountain lions, wolves, coyotes, even eagles) I believe. Can't believe that is not some factor in the Sierras.

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Vince
People pay way more attention nowadays.

Pay more attention to what? Did we read the same article?

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The cure for a fallacious argument is a better argument, not the suppression of ideas.
-- Carl Sagan

FF: The primary threat to sheep in the Rockies is predation (mountain lions, wolves, coyotes, even eagles) I believe. Can't believe that is not some factor in the Sierras.


I don't think that the Sierra has nearly as many predators (a non-statistical general statement) as some of the other mountain ranges (especially wolves).There are catamounts(ask Vince), but I believe that they are much more spaced apart than wolves would be (and I think that they eat less often).

QB

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Bee
FF: I don't think that the Sierra has nearly as many predators ... (and I think that they eat less often).

QB

Hopefully. Especially for those folks that like to hike alone!

Seriously, I was surprised to learn that efforts to re-introduce mountain goats to a small wilderness area in Montana were being thwarted by, of all things, eagles as the primary predator of small goats.

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The cure for a fallacious argument is a better argument, not the suppression of ideas.
-- Carl Sagan

Bee,

Talk about predators! Stay out of Pate Valley in the Grand Canyon of Yosemite. There are Orchs living there that have killed off all the sheep that used to live there.

Jim

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tomdisco
Bee,

Talk about predators! Stay out of Pate Valley in the Grand Canyon of Yosemite. There are Orchs living there that have killed off all the sheep that used to live there.

Jim

Orcs? I was mainly concerned with the number of rattle snakes I saw there.

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eeek

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tomdisco
Bee,

Talk about predators! Stay out of Pate Valley in the Grand Canyon of Yosemite. There are Orchs living there that have killed off all the sheep that used to live there.

Jim

Orcs? I was mainly concerned with the number of rattle snakes I saw there.

Due to technical difficulties, I cannot Wikipedia tonight, so I have to take the plunge (bait) and ask what an Orc is (a mythical creature that I have forgotten, maybe?)

QB

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Bee
Due to technical difficulties, I cannot Wikipedia tonight, so I have to take the plunge (bait) and ask what an Orc is (a mythical creature that I have forgotten, maybe?)

QB

Orc are evil creatures descended from Elves that were enslaved by Morgoth.

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eeek

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Bee
Due to technical difficulties, I cannot Wikipedia tonight, so I have to take the plunge (bait) and ask what an Orc is (a mythical creature that I have forgotten, maybe?)

QB

Orc are evil creatures descended from Elves that were enslaved by Morgoth.

LOTR -- NOW I remember (I am not caught up on sleep yet) they were quite hideous.

QB

If you want to know more, read .

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eeek
If you want to know more, read .

I have the history and literature of three different countries stuffed up into my brain; I am starting to drop bits into the bucket..I cannot remember the details of the few volumes that I chose to read for fun.

QB

It's not a new problem, is all I'm saying. I'm not sure it's even a problem at all, really...some group is making it one. Bighorn sheep, which range in the Sierra all the way down into Mexico (read about them living in Anza-Borrego Desert State Park) and all over Nevada's basin-range, seem to be susceptible to funny diseases.

Beware those environmentalists making political hay out of the goats er, I mean sheep. They're trying to shut off the wild country to human access. That's all this is...another liberal land grab. They already got millions of acres shut off with the wilderness act last month. Give them a mile, they'll take a thousand.

If anyone is interested:
list of sheep diseases (some sound like hiker diseases):
Scrapie is interesting. It is the sheep equivalent of Mad Cow Disease (probably prion mediated)


Campylobacter
Chlamydia
Toxoplasmosis
Ovine Progressive Pneumonia
Caseous Lymphadenitis
Feedlot Rectal Prolapse
Footrot
Sore mouth
Scrapie
Pinkeye
Lamb Starvation
Baby Lamb Scours
Coccidiosis
White Muscle Disease
Enterotoxemia
Bacterial meningitis
Polioencephalomalacia
Listerosis
Rabies
Tetanus

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The cure for a fallacious argument is a better argument, not the suppression of ideas.
-- Carl Sagan

FF's research is great. Look up all of those on wiki (I won't). Seems to me a species that susceptible to pretty much everything has been naturally selected to go away? Or am I missing something here?

Here's the skinny.

I lived and worked on my mom's goat farm for almost 20 years. Maa-aaa-aaa.

Anyway, FF posted a list of Mountain Goat, errrr sheep diseases. I talked to my mom in San Diego (600 miles from here, Hi Mom) because she is a goat, errr sheep expert.

Camphylobacter: A bacteria that causes ulcers.
Chlamydia: It's an STD.
Toxoplasmosis: Never seen it in a goat.
Ovine Progressive Pneumonia: Nope.
Caseous Lymphadenitis. Its a bacteria that causes absesses in the lymph glands. Very common (and gross when one pops all over you).
Feedlot Rectal Prolapse. Nope. (thank God, mom didn't know what it was and I most definitely don't want to know)
Footrot: common for places that have standing moisture and goats...errr...sheep standing in it.
Sore mouth: caused by a virus. Ever have a cold sore?
Scrapie: My mom said, "Ewwwww" It's caused by a prion not unlike mad cow's disease.
Pinkeye: See chlamydia.
Lamb Starvation. Well, let's think about this. Hmmmmm. Bab mom, usually. Run away! What's that that just came out of me? Ewe!
Baby Lamb Scours: You can tell by the poop, green, yellow or white, caused by bacterial infection or overfeeding. I'm not going anywhere with this.
Coccidiosis: It's a microorganism that the fancy water filter you bought for when you're hiking in the Sierra won't filter out unless you go smaller than 2 microns.
White Muscle Disease: Selenium deficiency. If the soil doesn't have it, neither will the plants, and thus won't the goat....err sheep.
Enterotoxemia. PH imbalance. There are shots for that but no one's giving the Bighorn any shots that I know of.
Bacterial meningitis: Mom said, "High school children get that."
Polioencephalamalacia: Besides being a mouthful, mom said "I'll have to look that one up." AKA, never heard of it. But we're talking goats, right?
Lysterosis: Lysteria. Bad for preggo females.
Rabies: Ever been bitten by a rabid sheep? Ever really even seen one, or even imagine one?
Tetanus: It's an anaerobic bacteria that is transmitted through polluted soil (or rusty nails). Usually found around where horses have been. That's right, it's Bush's fault.

Well, mom also added this: almost everything on the list is transmitted by insects. Not by humans.

But she also added this: the problem with the Bighorn being so susceptible is in part due to Freeways. Bighorn are prolific in Mexico but they can't get up here to cross, and the lack of genetic diversity is killing off the ones we have up here, these little pockets of animals are inbred.

I didn't ask if I were...

I think the closure requests referred to preventing contact between domestic sheep and wild sheep. I don't read any specific restriction on human visitation or activities on the land in question.

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The cure for a fallacious argument is a better argument, not the suppression of ideas.
-- Carl Sagan

Vince: >But she also added this: the problem with the Bighorn being so susceptible is in part due to Freeways. Bighorn are prolific in Mexico but they can't get up here to cross, and the lack of genetic diversity is killing off the ones we have up here, these little pockets of animals are inbred.

I didn't ask if I were...<

I am inhibited by the fact that I was raised to be VERY polite....otherwise.....there would be a world of response to give forth...

QB

I was merely going to inquire why one might think that there was any need to ask.

(It's best to phrase these things so that they can be interpreted in more than one way.)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2009 07:39PM by szalkowski.