Re: John Muir Trail + High Sierra Trail - Yosemite to Sequoia??

New to this board. Been on the Whitney board for several years. I posted this there and one of those guys suggested I try here.

I'm thinking about a trip that would start in Yosemite on the JMT and jump over to the High Sierra Trail (with or without bagging Whitney on the way by) and finish in Sequoia. Anyone ever done that. Would love a trip report link or advice. I've done the HST but never the JMT. Seems like those 280 or so miles would cover the best parts of the Sierra and be a hell of a trip.
Thanks
Bryan

Billy! Take a lookie at this post; Mikey directed him this way.

Of course that would be an awesome adventure.
Probably someone has done just about anything you can think of especially if it is on trail.
Here's my suggestions:
- Skip Whitney - you already did HST
- Consider starting at one of these, not Happy Isles:
* Tuolumne Meadows
* Agnews
* Reds
* Lake Mary
- I'd start at Agnews so I could see Garnet, skipping Yosemite entirely
- I'd skip Vermillion Valley Resort and resupply at Muir Trail Ranch
- After Forester I'd go to Lake South America . I love the Upper Kern River Basin
and Lake Jessica. Follow the Kern all the way down... really cool...
- Consider ending at Mineral King
- Consider Black Rock pass instead of Nines Lakes Basin

Agnews to Crescent Meadow was 200 miles from the program I have.
Agnews to Mineral King would be less.

At the end of the day though. It doesn't really matter. It's all good.

I guess I better mention that the trails around Lake South America are no longer maintained.
If you get a SEKI nps map they won't be on it anymore. You can definitely lose the trail.
I'd go that way in a heartbeat though. I was so happy get off the JMT when I was in that area last time.

Here's a picture of Lake Jessica - Great Western Divide in the background

No clue on how this looks to others but I spent an hour here soaking my feet enjoying
knowing no one else was within miles of me.

Thanks for the advice!
I've been reading JMT trip reports (having never done the trail) and it seems like skipping Yosemite altogether and starting a bit futher down the trail is not a bad idea. I can't stand crowds and starting with the Half Dome folks and rv'ers doesn't sound very appealing. Also seems like no one likes VVR so resupplying at Muir may be the way to go.
Best time of year? Trying to avoid most of the bugs, crowds and heat (aren't we all). I'm thinking mid Sept and taking about 3 weeks. I know snow is a factor late in the season and I'm not a big fan of hiking through lots of it, but I'm even less a fan of hiking with bugs, heat and crowds.
Is there a time of year that is a good balance?

I know you said you don't like bugs (and I don't care much for them, myself). But to give the other side of the coin: I went this past early July. There were lots of mosquitoes and post-holed through a fair amount of snow. Some of the passes were a pain for me (my buddy is a mountaineer and he was loving it). We had a couple of scary stream crossings and I fell in twice ).

But I'm glad we went when we did. The snow added so much to the beauty of the landscape. Wildflowers were spectacular and at places it seemed like waterfalls and streams were gushing out of every crevice.

It was the first time I did the full JMT, but have done the first 50 miles from Yosemite several times. This was the first time I saw these places early in the year, usually going in fall for the reasons that you mention. I couldn't believe how much more incredibly beautiful everything was! Green, water, flowers....it's just not the same experience.

Believe it or not, we got somewhat used to the mosquitoes...just used deet. The "hardships" of post-holing and undiscernable trails over the passes have become part of the cherished memory.

Crowds die down after school starts. By then mosquitos are down to almost nil.

Here's my reasoning for saying skipping Yosemite. ... and for me that is almost sacrilidge
since I LOVE Yosemite so much:
- You wanted to add the HST
- I almost always go up the Mist Trail which is quicker and nicer IMO
(ok, Ideal route for scenery is up Mist to Vernal then JMT to Nevada)
- I don't think the JMT is the "best" route to Tuolumne Meadows
(you miss so much of the Merced River Canyon)
(I think the designers just HAD to go by Cathedral because of it's history with Muir)

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bill-e-g

- I don't think the JMT is the "best" route to Tuolumne Meadows
(you miss so much of the Merced River Canyon)

I agree. The JMT from YV to TM is fine, but from TM going up Lyell Canyon, over Vogelsang Pass and down the Merced River Canyon is incredible!

Is that route part (Merced River Canyon) of the JMT or are you guys talking about alternate trails? I'm off to REI tonight to pick up a map and start planning, so I'm a little uneducated right now when it comes to specific places along the trail.

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bugsdad
Is that route part (Merced River Canyon) of the JMT or are you guys talking about alternate trails? I'm off to REI tonight to pick up a map and start planning, so I'm a little uneducated right now when it comes to specific places along the trail.

No, it's not really a part of the JMT, at least not the part suggested as an alternate route. The JMT breaks away from the Merced River at the western end of Little Yosemite Valley (just above Nevada Fall) proceeding uphill past Half Dome and Clouds Rest on the way to Sunrise High Sierra Camp and the Cathedral Peak area to Tuolumne Meadows. The alternate route being suggested goes directly up Little Yosemite Valley and Merced River Canyon past Merced Lake and on up to Vogelsang Peak via Lewis Creek Trail. Then it decends to Vogelsang High Sierra Camp where you can proceed to Tuolumne Meadows one of two ways. The best of these is the longer one, going past Evelyn Lake to Lyell Canyon and then out to the meadow via the Tuolumne River.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/11/2010 07:08PM by tomdisco.

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bugsdad
The best of these is the longer one, going past Evelyn Lake to Lyell Canyon and then out to the meadow via the Tuolumne River.

I assume you actually hit the JMT when you get to Lyell Canyon and hang a left back to TM ?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/12/2010 06:04PM by The Other Tom.

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The Other Tom
I assume you actually hit the JMT when you get to Lyell Canyon and hang a left back to TM ?

You do assuming you want to go to Tuolumne Meadows.

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eeek

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The Other Tom
I assume you actually hit the JMT when you get to Lyell Canyon and hang a left back to TM ?

You do assuming you want to go to Tuolumne Meadows.

Actually, you hit the Pacific Crest Trail at Lyell Canyon. At 4.2 miles later east of Tuolumne Meadows near the Wilderness Permit Station the Pacific Crest Trail splits. The regular portion (right) continues pass the permit station, across Tioga Road and into Tuolumne Meadows. The other branch (left) goes one mile and terminates at Tuolumne Meadows Campground. This is also where The JMT terminates, coming from the opposite direction.

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tomdisco

Actually, you hit the Pacific Crest Trail at Lyell Canyon. At 4.2 miles later east of Tuolumne Meadows near the Wilderness Permit Station the Pacific Crest Trail splits. The regular portion (right) continues pass the permit station, across Tioga Road and into Tuolumne Meadows. The other branch (left) goes one mile and terminates at Tuolumne Meadows Campground. This is also where The JMT terminates, coming from the opposite direction.

I wasn't aware that the JMT terminated at Tuolumne Meadows Campground. Or maybe I misunderstood your post ?

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The Other Tom

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tomdisco

Actually, you hit the Pacific Crest Trail at Lyell Canyon. At 4.2 miles later east of Tuolumne Meadows near the Wilderness Permit Station the Pacific Crest Trail splits. The regular portion (right) continues pass the permit station, across Tioga Road and into Tuolumne Meadows. The other branch (left) goes one mile and terminates at Tuolumne Meadows Campground. This is also where The JMT terminates, coming from the opposite direction.

I wasn't aware that the JMT terminated at Tuolumne Meadows Campground. Or maybe I misunderstood your post ?

According to the National Geo Trails Illustrated Map that's where it terminates.

Jim

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tomdisco

According to the National Geo Trails Illustrated Map that's where it terminates.

Jim

Interesting. Most folks would say the the northern terminus is Happy Isles in Yosemite Valley, and the southern terminus is Mt. Whitney.

By the way, I'm trying to decipher you IP address. Are you in N.C. ? If so, I'm just right down the road from you.

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The Other Tom

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tomdisco

According to the National Geo Trails Illustrated Map that's where it terminates.

Jim

Interesting. Most folks would say the the northern terminus is Happy Isles in Yosemite Valley, and the southern terminus is Mt. Whitney.

By the way, I'm trying to decipher you IP address. Are you in N.C. ? If so, I'm just right down the road from you.

Tom,

You are correct. I was misreading the map with the color codes they were using. The JMT and Pacific Crest run concurrently down Lyell Canyon direction but the map uses the color for the PCT all the way. John Muir would be very upset with me!

Jim

The PCT and JMT split at TM. The JMT continues to Happy Isles while the PCT goes by Glen Aulin as it heads north to Canada.

The JMT and PCT also split apart between Reds Meadow and Thousand Island Lake.
PCT goes thru Agnew Meadows and bypasses completely Rosalie, Shadow, and Garnet.

Shadow Lake and Garnet are awesome IMO so anyone doing the PCT is missing out.

bugsdad,
It's not alternate route of the JTM per se. Probably if you are going to do the JMT you should just stick to the JMT.
If you don't then you'll probably lament over it. There's a section by Lake T. Edison that we skipped b/c we
decided that we would rather hike a trail than a lakebed. It'll probably be years before I get back there.
I was just trying to justify why I said skip Yose.
A "better" way to Sunrise IMO is to Echo Valley and then up Echo Creek. The trail along Sunrise Creek, and
for that matter all the way from LYV up until you crest S of Sunrise Mtn, isn't spectacular. Or at least
it sure isn't as nice as up the Merced.
Anyway, did u come up with a pass 1 tentative route?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/14/2010 12:23PM by bill-e-g.

Well...after much research I think at this point I'm planning on starting at Tuolumne sometime on or around Sept. 7th (to avoid the Labor Day rush) and hiking for 19-20 days. Have to be back at work on the 28th. From Tuolumne follow the traditional JMT/PCT route to where it meets the HST (does it meet it?) and skip Whitney. Doing Whitney again as a day hike with my Mom sometime in July. Follow the HST through to Crescent Meadow and call it done.

Question:
Are there options for resupply after Muir Ranch? I don't have friends that can hike in and meet me and I don't want to leave the trail if possible. Still no map in hand, so how many miles would you guess it is from MR to Crescent Meadow? This could of course derail the whole plan. I think I can go 10-12 days without a resupply if I plan it right but if we're talking 2 full weeks from Muir then I may have to rethink the whole route.

Thanks again for everyones input. I'm still in the beginning planning stages of this, so I'm very open to alternate plans.

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bugsdad
I'm planning on starting at Tuolumne sometime on or around Sept. 7th (to avoid the Labor Day rush) and hiking for 19-20 days.

You might get some snow.

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eeek

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bugsdad
I'm planning on starting at Tuolumne sometime on or around Sept. 7th (to avoid the Labor Day rush) and hiking for 19-20 days.

You might get some snow.

There is no Labor Day rush, at least as far as the high country is concerned.One might think that people would flock to the park at that time, but it doesn't seem to happen. My read is that most people are too busy getting the kids ready to go back to school and don't really have the time.

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bugsdad

Question:
Are there options for resupply after Muir Ranch? I don't have friends that can hike in and meet me and I don't want to leave the trail if possible. Still no map in hand, so how many miles would you guess it is from MR to Crescent Meadow? This could of course derail the whole plan. I think I can go 10-12 days without a resupply if I plan it right but if we're talking 2 full weeks from Muir then I may have to rethink the whole route.

Yes, you can resupply at MTR (Muir Trail Ranch). You have to send a bucket of supplies to them and they will hold it for you. Cost ~$50. They have a very minimum store, but by early fall the hiker barrels should be full (free for the taking). They close sometime in the fall, not sure when. You can get the details at their website. http://www.muirtrailranch.com/

Like others have said, you might want to start a week or so earlier to avoid bad weather.

Is there any place to resupply between Muir Ranch and Crescent Meadow? I'm thinking no but maybe someone knows a secret spot.
I'll take the snow and weather into consideration and think about starting earlier. I really don't like hiking with crowds and never having done the JMT I don't really have a sense of when it's "busy" time is. I assumed labor day would be a busy time, but then again most folks might be timing their trips to end around then. I don't want to deal with snow gear I know that.

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bugsdad
Is there any place to resupply between Muir Ranch and Crescent Meadow? I'm thinking no but maybe someone knows a secret spot.

Not really, unless you hike in before hand and put a stash somewhere (probably illegal). There are a few "exits" on the trail back to civilization. Most people prefer Kearsarge pass back to Onion Valley. Also, you can hike down to Whitney Portal, but then the hike back up......
Also, you can pay a packer to pack in a supply and meet you on the trail. Google High Sierra Pack Stations . Cost big bucks, though.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/14/2010 06:56PM by The Other Tom.

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The Other Tom
Not really, unless you hike in before hand and put a stash somewhere

Or have a friend hike in with supplies.

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(probably illegal).

I don't think it's illegal. But you would need to make sure your cache was bear (and other critter) proof.

Sounds like if I want to make it from Muir Ranch all the way to Crescent Meadow at the end of the HST then I'll be doing without resupply. Anyone know the mileage between the 2?

I get 98 miles from Muir Ranch to Crescent Meadow.
I did not verify that the routing tool followed the JMT and the HST exactly as there are some trails that might be little shortcuts that could deviate from the official trail.
The track looks good though so I feel confident that 98 miles is very close.

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Old Dude



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/14/2010 08:39PM by mrcondron.

Thanks! That actually feels do-able. It'd be a heavy with food trip, but not bad mileage wise.

Here is a picture of the route: (Ignore the brown part of the route. It's from an old trip.)

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Old Dude



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/14/2010 09:26PM by mrcondron.

Ah, now I remember Crescent Meadow. The walk from Bear Paw to Crescent meadow seemed to go on forever!

Mike, sorry, but no way is that the HST. The High Sierra Trail loops way down and
then comes back up the Big Arroyo. Almost a U on the south part.
You can get to the HST from the JMT (reread what I originally wrote).. by 4 ways:
Tyndall, Wallace, South of Lake South America, and going up and down Lake SA.
I recommended the last one which goes right by Lake SA.
Tyndall I think was approx 120 miles.

Billy,
You're right. I'll rerun the route putting a waypoint in at the junction where the JMT and the HST meet. On the posted route I let the routing tool pick it's own way from from Muir to Crescent. 98 vs 120 ain't toooo bad.

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Old Dude

Ok Mike I see where you drew. You got him diving off the JMT/PCT and going up and over Granite Pass,
dropping into Kings Canyon/Roads End then going over Avalanche Pass by the Sphinx and south to
Elizabeth Pass ..

The distance from MTR to Crescent is anywhere from about 125 to 135.
I measured 135 taking the "go look at Lake South America Route".
There are many many xcountry routes that can really cut down on the
mileage but that's all I'll say about that.
(I've only done a couple of xcountry trips in SEKI)

Anyone know how an HST permit would work if coming from the other direction? Do I need to go to Sequoia first to pick up a permit....that would not be fun.
Would I need an HST permit if I was ending instead of starting at Crescent Meadow?

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bugsdad
Anyone know how an HST permit would work if coming from the other direction? Do I need to go to Sequoia first to pick up a permit....that would not be fun.
Would I need an HST permit if I was ending instead of starting at Crescent Meadow?

You get the permit from the agency responsible for the initial trailhead. It's good for the entire trip.

Would be nice to know if this occurred.

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