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Re: Dis iz Wilderness?

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avatar Dis iz Wilderness?
August 18, 2010 08:03AM
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 18, 2010 08:10AM
From the Hoover Wilderness Sign:

"What is Wilderness?"
"Wilderness is an area designated by Congress to preserve natural communities of life
from the encroachment and the expanding imprint of human development. In wilderness
natural forces and conditions dominate the landscape and the area is managed to
retain it's primeval character and influence while providing opportunities for primitive
recreation and solitude."
"Wilderness areas are managed to preserve natural conditions. They serve as an
important habitat for wildlife species, protect watersheds and drinking water, and act
as biological reserves for native vegetation and animal species. Wilderness areas
may also have ecological, geological, historical, scientific, educational and scenic values."



Chick-on is looking at you!
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 18, 2010 08:14AM
Can't make out what all it says on the Kennedy Meadows Emigrant Wilderness sign.
But... I think it says ... "Poop does not affect the watershed." and
"Cows are part of the natural environment."

sigh...



Chick-on is looking at you!
Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 18, 2010 02:16PM
Does chick-on poop affect the watershed?
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 19, 2010 07:25AM
Is no one else appalled at this?
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 19, 2010 10:40AM
Quote
bill-e-g
Is no one else appalled at this?


It does seem extremely cruel to force the pretty cowses [sic] to look at Chick-on.
(AdorablyBeautifully Yours)
The Marmots

P.S. You never actually pinpointed the location of the photo.
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 19, 2010 11:01AM
Kennedy Lake

I will never go back there unless it is very early in the season (bc <before cows> ).
First time many years ago we were dodging cow pies too...

The area above the lake is amazing (we actually came down from Lost Lake) though.

Must have been easily 50 head of cattle around Kennedy Lake. Felt like a barnyard.

Kennedy Lake:
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 19, 2010 11:05AM
There was well over 50:

Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 19, 2010 12:55PM
I don't like cows out there, obliterating the grass and trails... leaving poop everywhere... and I also tend to think there should be limits on stock use of trails, unless you are using something that does not wear big metal shoes that pound the ground to silt. Like goats.

Why we are the only leave no trace critters I could not tell you... the horse folks (and I love horses, don't get me wrong) get to take 20 mules out at a time and we can only go in groups of 15? And we all have two softly shod feet? Not Fair At All.

At least PG&E will pay our search and rescue volunteers to go put up fences around alpine meadows to protect them from livestock. We do it every year, put up the wire when snow melts and take it down before winter hits.
Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 20, 2010 09:51AM
Quote
AlmostThere
I don't like cows out there, obliterating the grass and trails... leaving poop everywhere... and I also tend to think there should be limits on stock use of trails, unless you are using something that does not wear big metal shoes that pound the ground to silt. Like goats.

Why we are the only leave no trace critters I could not tell you... the horse folks (and I love horses, don't get me wrong) get to take 20 mules out at a time and we can only go in groups of 15? And we all have two softly shod feet? Not Fair At All.

At least PG&E will pay our search and rescue volunteers to go put up fences around alpine meadows to protect them from livestock. We do it every year, put up the wire when snow melts and take it down before winter hits.
Why do you have to take it down?
Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 20, 2010 09:53AM
Quote
hotrod4x5
Quote
AlmostThere
I don't like cows out there, obliterating the grass and trails... leaving poop everywhere... and I also tend to think there should be limits on stock use of trails, unless you are using something that does not wear big metal shoes that pound the ground to silt. Like goats.

Why we are the only leave no trace critters I could not tell you... the horse folks (and I love horses, don't get me wrong) get to take 20 mules out at a time and we can only go in groups of 15? And we all have two softly shod feet? Not Fair At All.

At least PG&E will pay our search and rescue volunteers to go put up fences around alpine meadows to protect them from livestock. We do it every year, put up the wire when snow melts and take it down before winter hits.
Why do you have to take it down?

You know all that snow that falls? And all the trees that fall down in winter? If you take down the wire, the posts will (mostly) stay in one piece.
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 20, 2010 11:12AM
Quote
szalkowski
Quote
bill-e-g
Is no one else appalled at this?


It does seem extremely cruel to force the pretty cowses [sic] to look at Chick-on.
(AdorablyBeautifully Yours)
The Marmots

P.S. You never actually pinpointed the location of the photo.


Quote
bill-e-g
Kennedy Lake


P.P.S. Don't even think about blaming us for them being there.
(Veganly Yours)
The Marmots
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 19, 2010 02:39PM
Quote
bill-e-g
Is no one else appalled at this?

Have you been to Dome Lands?
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 23, 2010 05:11PM
Quote
eeek
Quote
bill-e-g
Is no one else appalled at this?

Have you been to Dome Lands?

Nope... please explain...
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 23, 2010 05:23PM
Domeland Wilderness area is in the southern Sierra. The south fork of the Kern River runs through it. Lots of grazing goes on there and the ranchers even go in and dig water channels to improve the growth of grass.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domeland_Wilderness
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 23, 2010 06:37PM
That's ridiculous. sigh...
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 23, 2010 06:56PM
Quote
bill-e-g
That's ridiculous. sigh...

Probably grandfathered in and so far no politician is willing to go up against the grazing lobby.
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 23, 2010 09:32PM
Quote
eeek
Quote
bill-e-g
That's ridiculous. sigh...

Probably grandfathered in and so far no politician is willing to go up against the grazing lobby.

It's ridiculous. We removed the sheep herders ... but this is OK?
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 24, 2010 07:34AM
Quote
bill-e-g
Quote
eeek
Quote
bill-e-g
That's ridiculous. sigh...

Probably grandfathered in and so far no politician is willing to go up against the grazing lobby.

It's ridiculous. We removed the sheep herders ... but this is OK?

What really was impressionable was the whole valley was mowed down.... All the grass was consumed all around when Bill-e-g and I went by- meaning there were about 3-4 inches of nicely trimmed grass versus a foot or more. Also, it was a hassle to skirt the mud as well as the moo-pies. In the end, yours truly, had a foot in the mud. argh!

The lake itself, had lots of green-brown algae underwater forests in it. Making it not my first choice for sure.

Dunno what that area offers from a nutritional value vs other parts. Guess I have to sample the product, and in fact, when one of the younger bulls gave us the stare and began to plant face on us- I think Goatie reminded him we were about to eat his bretheren!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/24/2010 07:35AM by Catalonian Burro.
Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 20, 2010 10:52AM
This really bugs me too. I was backpacking in Utah one time and my map showed a fresh water spring. I arranged my route to replenish my water supply there. When I got there it was in the middle of a cow pasture with about 40 head of cows. The cows were trampling in the spring, urinating, crapping, etc. Needless to say the water was contaminated. And it was supposed to be wilderness! Horses to, They destroy the trails, they stink, leave droppings everywhere, create dust. I hate coming up on them on the trail. I would much rather see dogs on the trails rather than horses. Oh well sorry to rant just my humble opinion.
avatar Re: Dis iz Wilderness?
August 29, 2010 06:11PM
Quote
chick-on


These might be prank cows (being held in preserve/reserve):
http://www.amazon.com/If-All-Possible-Involve-Cow/dp/0312078102
... and one crank chick-on.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2010 06:12PM by szalkowski.
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