Yosemite, CA — A trek to Half Dome on a closed trail led to a helicopter rescue at Yosemite National Park on Wednesday.
http://www.mymotherlode.com/news/local/279571/hikers-rescued-at-yosemite.html
December 31, 2016 02:43PM | Admin Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 17,096 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 01, 2017 09:11PM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 931 |
January 02, 2017 09:07AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 1,634 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 02, 2017 10:28PM | Registered: 9 years ago Posts: 409 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 03, 2017 09:10AM | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 85 |
Quote
Not quite The Geezer, but getting there
That's my sentiment too. Do you know if in actuality people who are rescued are charged for the S&R services?
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 04, 2017 12:23PM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
Quote
"In 1997 the National Park Service spent 3.4 million dollars on Search and Rescue," Ken said. "Today people may have to pay the helicopter and ambulance charges for their rescue."
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 04, 2017 10:19PM | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 85 |
Quote
ags
@LVRAY I thought I remembered "somebody" (some publication, I believe from NPS but I could be wrong) making a lot of noise about "be sure to not exceed your limits when hiking the Grand Canyon. Bring plenty of water. Helicopter rescues are expensive...".
This was from before the NPS installed drinking fountains along the Kaibob Trail...
From here: http://kaibab.org/kaibab.org/gcps/gcps4_12.htmQuote
"In 1997 the National Park Service spent 3.4 million dollars on Search and Rescue," Ken said. "Today people may have to pay the helicopter and ambulance charges for their rescue."
Of course, Kaibob.org may not be a definitive source on the matter (but they claim to be quoting an NPS ranger). I thought then that this might be just scare tactics ("It will cost you a lot, so don't get into this situation...). You raise some good points about the potential for unintended consequences (death, more difficult rescues) and it seems that just the threat of having to pay - true or not - would be the worst possible strategy. Taxpayers are still not reimbursed (although there may be fewer calls) and people die.
January 02, 2017 12:50PM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 84 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 02, 2017 04:53PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,461 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 04, 2017 10:30AM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
January 04, 2017 10:54AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 7,421 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 04, 2017 02:21PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,461 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 04, 2017 10:10PM | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 85 |
Quote
ags
However, unless it is to protect environment/flora/fauna, can they really declare an area off-limits (and enforce it - by citations, fines, removal, etc) for safety?
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 05, 2017 09:07AM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,461 |
January 05, 2017 11:04AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 7,421 |
January 22, 2017 08:26PM | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 299 |
Quote
ags
...
Each time I've spoken with a ranger, it seems to me (might be my perception, but I don't think it's terribly skewed in this instance) that s/he never says "Yes - do that" - or "No! don't do that". It's more like "there is risk in that activity and I wouldn't advise it" or "you will have to decide that for yourself". I once asked about free-climbing to the summit of Cathedral Peak (years ago). I hadn't done much research (and thought it was just a natural continuation of the relatively easy walk up the lower slope). I was advised that "it's a granite block about 20' tall. John Muir climbed it without ropes. He was an amazing person; I wouldn't do that myself". I remember that well (the height of the block may be wrong). I wasn't told "Don't to that, you obviously unprepared and inexperienced noob!".
...
January 23, 2017 08:46AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 1,634 |
January 02, 2017 07:08PM | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 670 |
January 03, 2017 10:58AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 1,634 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 03, 2017 11:09AM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 184 |
Quote
Dave
I'm assuming the cables have been removed for the winter. Would this person have been trying to use the cleats and poles attached to the granite? Or are those removed too?
January 03, 2017 11:35AM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 675 |
January 03, 2017 02:34PM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 1,634 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 03, 2017 06:18PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,976 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 03, 2017 07:31PM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 184 |
Respectfully disagree. In Yosemite when someone free climbs the nose route of El Cap or ice climbs the Yosemite Falls ice dome...or dons a flying squirrel suit and bombs off Taft...or slack lines Lost Arrow...or hang glides off Glacier...all part of our local culture - lauded, televised, admired. But if you're competent, know what you are doing, and try the winter cables...you are an.idiot?Quote
parklover
. There are a lot of idiots out there.
January 03, 2017 08:40PM | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 670 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 05, 2017 06:07PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,976 |
They went without snow or ice gear - hence this is why I called them idiots. If they were competent, knew what they were doing and came prepared for the conditions, they might be called crazy but not idiots.Quote
markskor
Respectfully disagree. In Yosemite when someone free climbs the nose route of El Cap or ice climbs the Yosemite Falls ice dome...or dons a flying squirrel suit and bombs off Taft...or slack lines Lost Arrow...or hang glides off Glacier...all part of our local culture - lauded, televised, admired. But if you're competent, know what you are doing, and try the winter cables...you are an.idiot?Quote
parklover
. There are a lot of idiots out there.
They may be certifiably crazy but they're not idiots.
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 12:00AM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 17 |
Quote
parklover
They went without snow or ice gear - hence this is why I called them idiots. If they were competent, knew what they were doing and came prepared for the conditions, they might be called crazy but not idiots.Quote
markskor
Respectfully disagree. In Yosemite when someone free climbs the nose route of El Cap or ice climbs the Yosemite Falls ice dome...or dons a flying squirrel suit and bombs off Taft...or slack lines Lost Arrow...or hang glides off Glacier...all part of our local culture - lauded, televised, admired. But if you're competent, know what you are doing, and try the winter cables...you are an.idiot?Quote
parklover
. There are a lot of idiots out there.
They may be certifiably crazy but they're not idiots.
January 06, 2017 07:38AM | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 269 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 08:53AM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 184 |
Sort of agree - Walking up to/trying the cables in winter is a grand adventure - legal, and many times having been written about....been there.Quote
JRinGeorgia
^ I disagree. Inspired irresponsibility is still irresponsible.
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 09:28AM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 931 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 01:22PM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 864 |
Quote
Our favorite Birds have been on the HD cables during the "offseason."
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 01:45PM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 02:07PM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 931 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 03:04PM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 864 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 13, 2017 09:15AM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 14, 2017 04:23PM | Registered: 11 years ago Posts: 313 |
Quote
ags
Is this incorrect? (I suppose another way of asking this is: is there a specific item marketed as a "Prusik", and does it offer any superior benefits to the generic items I've described?)
January 19, 2017 07:53PM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 84 |
On the last day of the previous era (Half Dome permits were introduced starting the next day) I went up this route with "cables down". I was just holding cables as you described. It was easy to lift the cables.Quote
ags
I've wondered about this. If it were possible to just pick up a cable (like a rope) one could use it hand-over-hand to just walk up. That would be about as safe as going up normally. But those cables are thick, and I bet they are heavy - really heavy, perhaps too heavy to barely budge off the granite. Did you even try to pick them up? I presume they just lie on the granite, ...
Seems like it would be a lot of fun (going up off-season, not bouncing to your death) with the added benefit of no permitting issues to deal with.
January 19, 2017 08:36PM | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 670 |
Quote
Yury
. . . snip . . .
Analysis of GPS data led me to believe that in case of good approach shoes with sticky rubber you even do not need to hold cables to safely hike up there.
It's about 30 degrees slope with a few steps about a foot high.
. . . snip
January 20, 2017 06:00AM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 84 |
I have no recollection of a steeper part.Quote
qumqats
There's a short stretch where I'm pretty sure its more than 30, quite a bit more?
I agree, that one or two meters right or left traction is a little bit better.Quote
qumqats
I don't doubt that you could get up there with just a pair of sticky shoes, but you're not going to do it at the cables. The granite around the cables is pretty well polished from decades of people going up and down. You'd have to go to one side or the other so you're on a virgin surface.
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 20, 2017 08:23AM | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 220 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 05:17PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,461 |
January 07, 2017 12:43AM | Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 670 |
January 06, 2017 02:40PM | Admin Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 17,096 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 03:32PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,976 |
January 06, 2017 04:04PM | Admin Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 17,096 |
January 06, 2017 08:37PM | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 269 |
January 07, 2017 01:11AM | Admin Registered: 15 years ago Posts: 17,096 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 03:28PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,976 |
I said that two people were idiots to do something that they were not prepared for and ended up having to be rescued that could have put others in danger and suddenly, I am accused of calling everyone idiots or being callous John Muir was who he was and he did not expect anyone to come and rescue him if he got into trouble. And yes we all do things on impulse or without enough forethought that in retrospect was not a good idea. I am also have been guilty of doing that but yet never put myself or others in danger.Quote
bruck
Quote
parklover
They went without snow or ice gear - hence this is why I called them idiots. If they were competent, knew what they were doing and came prepared for the conditions, they might be called crazy but not idiots.Quote
markskor
Respectfully disagree. In Yosemite when someone free climbs the nose route of El Cap or ice climbs the Yosemite Falls ice dome...or dons a flying squirrel suit and bombs off Taft...or slack lines Lost Arrow...or hang glides off Glacier...all part of our local culture - lauded, televised, admired. But if you're competent, know what you are doing, and try the winter cables...you are an.idiot?Quote
parklover
. There are a lot of idiots out there.
They may be certifiably crazy but they're not idiots.
John Muir nearly killed himself crawling out to a ledge so he could get a view from the top of Yosemite Falls. Are you just as callous towards him? While I, by no means, endorse the rescued hiker's actions, I think we can all relate to his impulse. Who among us has not taken a risk, has not taken that extra step, has not dangled ourselves over a precarious ledge or risked getting lost, all because we were so thoroughly seduced by the beauty and magic of Yosemite? You're looking at the situation from a practical standpoint, but there is nothing practical about what Yosemite can stir inside someone. And if you have yet to feel that, then that is unfortunate.
in the face of Yosemite scenery cautious remonstrance is vain; under its spell one’s body seems to go where it likes with a will over which we seem to have scarce any control
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 13, 2017 12:05AM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 17 |
Quote
parklover
I said that two people were idiots to do something that they were not prepared for and ended up having to be rescued that could have put others in danger and suddenly, I am accused of calling everyone idiots or being callous John Muir was who he was and he did not expect anyone to come and rescue him if he got into trouble. And yes we all do things on impulse or without enough forethought that in retrospect was not a good idea. I am also have been guilty of doing that but yet never put myself or others in danger.Quote
bruck
Quote
parklover
They went without snow or ice gear - hence this is why I called them idiots. If they were competent, knew what they were doing and came prepared for the conditions, they might be called crazy but not idiots.Quote
markskor
Respectfully disagree. In Yosemite when someone free climbs the nose route of El Cap or ice climbs the Yosemite Falls ice dome...or dons a flying squirrel suit and bombs off Taft...or slack lines Lost Arrow...or hang glides off Glacier...all part of our local culture - lauded, televised, admired. But if you're competent, know what you are doing, and try the winter cables...you are an.idiot?Quote
parklover
. There are a lot of idiots out there.
They may be certifiably crazy but they're not idiots.
John Muir nearly killed himself crawling out to a ledge so he could get a view from the top of Yosemite Falls. Are you just as callous towards him? While I, by no means, endorse the rescued hiker's actions, I think we can all relate to his impulse. Who among us has not taken a risk, has not taken that extra step, has not dangled ourselves over a precarious ledge or risked getting lost, all because we were so thoroughly seduced by the beauty and magic of Yosemite? You're looking at the situation from a practical standpoint, but there is nothing practical about what Yosemite can stir inside someone. And if you have yet to feel that, then that is unfortunate.
in the face of Yosemite scenery cautious remonstrance is vain; under its spell one’s body seems to go where it likes with a will over which we seem to have scarce any control
However, I take umbrage at being taken to task for calling two unprepared people idiots, it is my personal opinion which I should be allowed to express. You don't know anything about me and have no idea how Yosemite and other parks stir me. Since you don't know my real name you have no idea what I wrote for Find My Park and most likely have not read what I have posted here about my love of parks and evidently don't understand the meaning behind my name here - parklover. If you did, you would have never made that last comment about me. Yosemite is my heart, Yellowstone is my soul and Rocky Mountain sets my spirit free so yes, I do understand how Yosemite can stir ones hearts strings. Yosemite stirs me so much that after being there over 100 times, I still cry when I leave.
January 13, 2017 09:19AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 1,634 |
January 06, 2017 09:22AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 1,634 |
I agree... sort of. Not much difference between an idiot and someone that's crazy. They were certainly fools to attempt that climb without the proper equipment.Quote
parklover
They went without snow or ice gear - hence this is why I called them idiots. If they were competent, knew what they were doing and came prepared for the conditions, they might be called crazy but not idiots.
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 06, 2017 03:41PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 1,976 |
I guess we could call them crazy idiots? LOL In 20 years they are going to think back on it and wonder what ever possessed them to do that. Age tends to make one more aware of your own mortality.Quote
Dave
I agree... sort of. Not much difference between an idiot and someone that's crazy. They were certainly fools to attempt that climb without the proper equipment.Quote
parklover
They went without snow or ice gear - hence this is why I called them idiots. If they were competent, knew what they were doing and came prepared for the conditions, they might be called crazy but not idiots.
January 10, 2017 09:49PM | Registered: 12 years ago Posts: 218 |
January 20, 2017 09:49AM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 84 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 20, 2017 10:59AM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
January 20, 2017 03:59PM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 7,421 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 20, 2017 06:31PM | Registered: 13 years ago Posts: 953 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 20, 2017 08:54PM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
January 21, 2017 07:02AM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 7,421 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 21, 2017 04:09PM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
January 21, 2017 05:06PM | Moderator Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 7,421 |
January 22, 2017 02:19PM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 84 |
Get 6 mm rope e.g. http://www.sterlingrope.com/c/climbing_accessory-prusik-cord_6mm-accessory-cordQuote
ags
So where did you get your Prusik loops?
January 20, 2017 11:04AM | Registered: 14 years ago Posts: 84 |
Re: Half Dome Hikers Rescued January 20, 2017 01:02PM | Registered: 10 years ago Posts: 322 |
On my first attempt of the cables (during month of September I believe - it was cold but the cables were still up) I witnessed a father that had taken his young (~8 yr old) son up the cables, and gotten stuck on a sheet of ice. I don't know if it was dry when they started out, or they went up ice anyway. Poor kid was terrified, we had to form a human chain to get him down (it was near the bottom of the cables, there was very little discussion after their "rescue" so I was never able to fill in the details)Quote
Even if not starting the ascent with them, I'd bring them along as backup if conditions (or comfort level) changed on the way.