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Re: dogs and hiking

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dogs and hiking
September 06, 2016 10:29AM
Just about everywhere that dogs are allowed in the wilderness they are required to be on a leash. In California's national parks, they are not allowed on trails at all--in fact, the rule in most national parks is that dogs are allowed only on paved areas--anywhere you can take your car, you can take your dog.

That doesn't include any trails that aren't paved.

But we'd estimate that of the fifty dogs we've seen in the backcountry this year, about three of them have been on leashes. It's the single most frequently broken regulation that we see in the wilderness.

On our last trip to Caribou Wilderness, we ran into quite a few dogs, and only one of them was on a leash. But that dog was within a mile of the trailhead, just starting out, and we wonder how long he stayed on that leash. We don't say that because the owners looked untrustworthy--but the trails the Caribou Wilderness are rife with deadfall trees. We had to climb up and over, or around more than 75 trees on our hike there. And we can't image what you would do with a dog on a leash in that scenario. Our guess is that you would get pretty darn tired of the tangles.

Of course, some dogs we've met are extremely well trained and behaved. But not all are. And we worry not only about dogs interacting with other hikers. More of a concern is how they might interact with the local wildlife--chasing squirrels or deer, or even worse, fighting with something that might fight back.



Balzaccom

follow our adventures, read our blog, or just to come hang out at our website: http://www.backpackthesierra.com/
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 06, 2016 06:06PM
Quote
balzaccom
Just about everywhere that dogs are allowed in the wilderness they are required to be on a leash.

I'd always understood the USFS rule to be a lot looser, "on a leash or voice control". I looked at Inyo NF's pages and found nothing, but Google turns this up from Klamath NF:

Quote
Klamath NF
Dogs
• Dogs can cause problems with wildlife, pack-and-saddle stock and other dogs, and they may be annoying or threatening to other visitors. Be aware of these potential conflicts and keep your dog either on a leash or under direct voice control at all times.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/06/2016 06:07PM by ttilley.
Re: dogs and hiking
September 06, 2016 09:34PM
Thanks for that. In Desolation Wilderness they need to be on a leash. In Emigrant apparently the regulations are more like those in Klamath--which seem to be completely unenforceable, no?



Balzaccom

follow our adventures, read our blog, or just to come hang out at our website: http://www.backpackthesierra.com/
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 07, 2016 06:25AM
I'm not sure how the "or under direct voice control" part would be enforced unless the dog were completely free-range.

It makes sense that Desolation could be the unusual case here, it's a relatively small, very heavily used Wilderness Area in a popular region. I think it gets more regular patrols as well.
Re: dogs and hiking
September 07, 2016 04:49PM
Alaska wilderness areas generally say dogs should be on leashes. But NO ONE follows that rule. And generally speaking, it just is not a problem. I've often hiked with others who bring dogs and I've never seen a problem. I've been with dogs as we have encountered moose and perhaps the dogs I've hiked with are all experienced "hikers" but there has never been a problem.

Bottom Line: I seriously doubt that anyone who regularly hikes with dogs ever keeps them on a leash. That is just the way it is. What I see frequently is about a minute away from the trailhead the leashes come off...

I've also never seen a ranger hiking in Alaska so maybe it is different here. But knowing dog owners, I doubt it.
Re: dogs and hiking
September 08, 2016 10:11PM
Quote
balzaccom
Just about everywhere that dogs are allowed in the wilderness they are required to be on a leash.

But we'd estimate that of the fifty dogs we've seen in the backcountry this year, about three of them have been on leashes. It's the single most frequently broken regulation that we see in the wilderness.

You posted the same erroneous information in another forum, where someone wisely pointed out that there is no such requirement in wilderness areas where dogs are allowed, and that in any case the most frequently broken regulation anyone is likely to see in the Sierra is the rule about camping at least 100 feet from a water source.

Quote
balzaccom
Thanks for that. In Desolation Wilderness they need to be on a leash.

Not according to the US Forest Service. Their official page on the Desolation Wilderness states:

Pets should either be leashed or under direct voice control. Dogs can disturb other campers, get in fights with other dogs along the trail, and scare wildlife away. The Eldorado County leash laws will be enforced inside the wilderness boundary where dogs off leash are an impediment or hazard to the safety of any person, or where dogs are harassing or molesting wildlife.

Enforcement of the county leash law is situational, not mandatory.

These regulations are public information and readily available. Google is your friend.
Re: dogs and hiking
September 09, 2016 07:10AM
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camp9
Quote
balzaccom
Just about everywhere that dogs are allowed in the wilderness they are required to be on a leash.

But we'd estimate that of the fifty dogs we've seen in the backcountry this year, about three of them have been on leashes. It's the single most frequently broken regulation that we see in the wilderness.

You posted the same erroneous information in another forum, where someone wisely pointed out that there is no such requirement in wilderness areas where dogs are allowed, and that in any case the most frequently broken regulation anyone is likely to see in the Sierra is the rule about camping at least 100 feet from a water source.

Quote
balzaccom
Thanks for that. In Desolation Wilderness they need to be on a leash.

Not according to the US Forest Service. Their official page on the Desolation Wilderness states:

Pets should either be leashed or under direct voice control. Dogs can disturb other campers, get in fights with other dogs along the trail, and scare wildlife away. The Eldorado County leash laws will be enforced inside the wilderness boundary where dogs off leash are an impediment or hazard to the safety of any person, or where dogs are harassing or molesting wildlife.

Enforcement of the county leash law is situational, not mandatory.

These regulations are public information and readily available. Google is your friend.

Thanks for that correction. When I called the office in Desolation they told me dogs should be on leashes. Go figure.

I have only had one seriously unpleasant interaction with a dog on the trail, and that was in Emigrant about six years ago. Very large hunting hound that was completely out of its owner's control. Met us on the trail and barked viciously at us, while avoiding all attempts by the owner to grab its collar. We eventually got by it, and it basically barked and yapped about one foot behind us for about 200 yards. Owner finally grabbed its collar. When we were another 200 yards down the trail it returned and did it all over again.

We met a group of girl scouts about a mile later on the trail, and we've always wondered what happened when those little girls met the dog...

But on the other had, at least half of all the dogs we meet on the trail on off-leash and clearly not under any kind of voice control.

Then again, there was the guy who was heading up to the Beehive with his German shepherd. The Yosemite rangers really wanted a full description--photos if we had them--they were very unhappy that he had a dog in the back country.



Balzaccom

follow our adventures, read our blog, or just to come hang out at our website: http://www.backpackthesierra.com/




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2016 07:10AM by balzaccom.
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 09, 2016 06:30PM
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 09, 2016 07:18PM
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Bearproof
Rough

You mean Ruff?



Old Dude
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 11, 2016 01:49PM
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balzaccom
Then again, there was the guy who was heading up to the Beehive with his German shepherd.

I was passed on the Mist Trail by a guy with a German shepherd. Hoped there was a ranger at the top but there wasn't.
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 12, 2016 07:31AM
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eeek
Quote
balzaccom
Then again, there was the guy who was heading up to the Beehive with his German shepherd.

I was passed on the Mist Trail by a guy with a German shepherd. Hoped there was a ranger at the top but there wasn't.

If you have a phone... call dispatch...
(209)379-1992

The more complain... then maybe something will eventually be done...

Have seen dogs so many times... backcountry all over...
Really irks me... I go to Yosemite because they are not allowed...

Not a dog hater... just I really don't want to run into dogs out there ... unless they are coyotes...



Chick-on is looking at you!
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 12, 2016 02:25PM
Quote
chick-on
If you have a phone... call dispatch...
(209)379-1992

I should have done that. Not sure why I didn't.
Re: dogs and hiking
September 10, 2016 05:39PM
An exception?






Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2016 05:42PM by troutwild.
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 10, 2016 06:49PM
Dogs and their inconsiderate owners are a nuisance all over California. People think the rules don't apply to their dogs. Even when you see a dog in a restaurant or a grocery store, the owner will claim it's a service dog even though it most likely is not. I, too, am tired of having dogs run up to me on a trail or having to hear their incessant barking while I'm trying to find peace in the wilderness.



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avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 09, 2016 06:33AM
I keep my dawg on a short leash...



Of course dawg no obey... no understand mileage... elevation change...
or that to get a Payday you gotta keep hiking... you get it at the top o hill... not the bottom.

Feed ME!



Chick-on is looking at you!
Re: dogs and hiking
September 13, 2016 05:55PM
Isn't this the meadow next to Mono Village, which is private property and subject to the owner's wish of dogs only on leashes?
Re: dogs and hiking
September 13, 2016 05:58PM
Quote
chick-on
I keep my dawg on a short leash...



Of course dawg no obey... no understand mileage... elevation change...
or that to get a Payday you gotta keep hiking... you get it at the top o hill... not the bottom.

Feed ME!

Isn't this the meadow adjacent to Mono Village which is on private property and thus the leash signs?
avatar Re: dogs and hiking
September 13, 2016 08:04PM
Yes... but I'd put that guy on a leash no matter where...

Though may want to cut him lose due to the persistent veritable cornicopia of whining that
ensues when he duzn't get his treats...

tongue sticking out smiley

Have fun (please)



Chick-on is looking at you!
Re: dogs and hiking
September 10, 2016 05:54PM
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